Fit isn’t everything, but it’s awfully close. When you’re on a serious budget, compromising on fit in some areas can be worth considering or sometimes even a necessity. But there are other areas where you just shouldn’t settle for a so-so fit no matter how good the deal happens to be. Here’s where fit matters, in order of importance…
#1. Shoulders – Suits jackets, blazers, sport coats, shirts, and polos.
The fit through your shoulders is like the engine in your car. If it’s bad, forget all the rest. On average, American men wear their jackets about a size too big. And it completely shows up in the shoulders. It needs to fit here off the rack since a tailor can’t adjust them. Too big and you’ll look like a kid wearing something from Dad’s closet. Too small and you’ll look (and feel) constricted. To get the right fit, put on the jacket and stand next to a wall. Slowly lean into the wall with your shoulder. If the pad of the jacket strikes first, scrunches up, and your shoulder then follows a bit later, it’s too big. They need to hit at the same time. You want a jacket shoulder that follows the lines of your body, not one that creates new ones. For shirts, the seam should go on your shoulder. Not halfway to your elbow.
#2. The Waist – Jackets, Shirts, and Sweaters
Your waist is a terrible thing to waste. That goes for the heavier fellas too. Even if you’re hauling some extra pounds, failing to get your shirts tailored or your jackets brought in a touch at the sides could leave your BMI looking much higher than your actual number. Do you need to have EVERY shirt brought in? No. Of course not. If it fits then it fits. And if it doesn’t but you can’t invest right now? Wear a tailored sport coat or a well fitting sweater over it.
#3. Shoes
If you’re not comfortable in your shoes you’ll only look great while sitting down. Which is too bad, since that well tailored jacket looks even better when you’re standing up. Limping around with heel blisters or smashed toes isn’t good for your look. If you’re hard to fit, accept it, and stick with brands and widths you can walk a few miles in. If you’ve got a pair of shoes that are a little too big, these might help
#4. Jacket Length
There is an immense amount of debate over how long a sportcoat, blazer, or suit jacket should be. Some say: 100% butt coverage. But if you’ve got a long torso and shorter legs, covering all of your rear might leave you looking unbalanced and stumpy. Another method is to put on the jacket then curl up your fingers as seen below. The goal is to have the tail hit right in that valley of your grip, without it bunching or coming up noticeably short.
#5. Pant length or “Break”
No break means that when standing, your pant legs will be pretty close to stick straight since they’re short enough that they’re barely brushing the horizontal plane of your shoes. Medium break means they’ll kink and dent in a little, but still show some sock when you sit down and put one leg over the other. Full break is piles of fabric at your ankle. Go somewhere between no break and medium break (more from the Effortless Gent here.)
#6. Shirt Neck
It has to be comfortable but not cavernous when buttoned all the way up. Too small and it gets regulated to only tieless duty (or you’re stuck depending on a collar extender.) Too big and it looks sloppy. You want a collar that gets almost right up to your skin, but doesn’t choke. It’s like a pair of shoes. You’ll know if it’s too loose or too tight.
#7. Sleeve Length – Jackets and Shirts
Showing 1/4″ – 1/2″ of shirt cuff is ideal, but unless you’re walking around with your arms glued to your sides, your jacket sleeves are going to move around a little. Some brands (looking at you L.L. Bean Signature) make incredible blazers and jackets with slightly longer sleeves and tough to tailor functioning buttons. Sometimes it’s worthwhile to ignore it if it’s close and the price is better than good. For shirts, sleeve length should cover your wrist but not drift into the palm of your hand. Look for a shirt cuff that ends right where the meat of your thumb muscle begins when you’ve got your arms are at your sides.
#8. Pant Waist
Along with hiding an un-ironed shirt, a sport coat or blazer can do a fine job of covering up a pant waist that’s a little loose. But if you want to go beltless, that thing better be perfect.
#9. Tie Length
This can often be covered up by a jacket or sweater, but the end of your tie should hit your belt buckle. The middle of the buckle is the bull’s eye. It’s a small detail that makes a big difference. If you like big knots, consider longer ties.
#10. Shirt Tail Length
There’s a real simple solution for shirts that are too long to be worn untucked. Tuck the things in. It’s borderline sad to see some younger guy enjoying a night out while wearing an untucked traditional fit dress shirt. It’s reminiscent of those smocks we all had to wear in kindergarten when it was time to finger-paint. Untucked casual shirts shouldn’t drift much farther south than a few inches past your belt. Covering the entire fly of your pants is pushing it.
Agreements, disagreements, and other suggestions should go in the comments… Originally Published 11/15/11
Can’t agree more with #1. When I go shopping for suits/blazers, I can tell as soon as I put my first arm through to the shoulder whether or not the jacket will be good for me – it’s immediate and ingrained in my head exactly how the shoulder of the coat should hit my own, through practice.
#2: I’ve had an issue lately with the waist of a jacket and how it should fit after tailoring. In a lot of photos/ads I’ll see a tailored blazer look good because it was taken in at the sides but not so good because then it curves out around the hips. To me it should continue to contour down your thighs not all of a sudden curve out. It looks feminine to me and undercuts the masculine frame. Has anyone else noticed this? Is it just me?
#6: What are your thoughts on the collar extender? I have some older shirts that are still great except for the small neck. Acceptable or not?
Jose,
Regarding the jacket; it’s just as Joe points out- the jacket should be contoured to your body. For a lot of the ads that you see, the models are have slim waists, thereby making their hips likely wider than their waists, and hence giving the ‘coke-bottle’ shape that you’re describing.
For myself (I am pretty slim), I prefer that look for my jackets
That’s kinda what I’m saying. The curves looks feminine to me. Think “m” instead of “v”.
Without getting too far into the the anatomy of it, the most attractive male frame is one with angles and edges while the most attractive female frame is one with with curves. The tailored style I’m referring to is one in which the blazer starts off as a “v” but ends as an “m”.
If the jacket did truly contour to my body, then I don’t think I should see that because I don’t have large or rounded hips. Most slim guys or athletic guys don’t.
This is probably just extremely picky, but I was wondering if anyone else noticed that.
Here’s a tip…. If your shirt sleeves are too long it’s cheaper / easier to make your sleeve cuffs tighter rather than having them shortened. This will keep them from extending too far down your hand and they won’t look too long.
Jackets should cover the butt (+/- 1″ margin of error). Short suit jackets or sportcoats look very feminine to me. Looking at historical photos/and drawings from past periods where short jackets have been popular – still looks feminine in any era.
The finger curl method is okay, but the variation in arms length is greater than variation in torso length, so many people using the finger curl method can end with jackets that are too short.
Another way to determine appropriate jacket length is a formula i heard my tailor use: ((heigth in inches)/2) – 4GQ has done a huge disservise to men by promoting clothing that’s way too tight and short.
Fantastic list/analysis. This is quality information.
I have the opposite problem. I am 6’5″ and have very long limbs, which makes buying anything long sleeves a difficult task. Almost all of my shirts need to be rolled up or they are halfway up my forearm.
I’m approaching 6’3 and have the same issue with non-specific sized shirts (i.e., M, L, XL). Makes finding wintery (non-roll up) sports shirts near impossible
I have to disagree with your example pic on #6 – I think that collar is at least a half, if not a full, size too big. There is extra room all the way around; it looks off to my eye. I’ve always read the rule of thumb is that you should just be able to stick two fingers side-by-side in the collar when it is buttoned up. The collar in the pic could easily fit 4+ fingers.
Other than that quibble, great advice as usual.
On shirt collars – maybe I am an aberration, but if I have my shirt collars fit per the standard guideline (e.g. be able to stick up 2 fingers in it), i feel like I’m choking all the time. For me to be able to function, I need to order my shirt collars at least 0.75 larger than by supposedly proper size as determined by a tailor. Which means that every one in a while a gap between neck and shirt is noticeable, but it’s a small price to pay to be able to breathe and function. If I can’t stick 4 fingers in it, I can’t wear it… lol The only major drawback is that most OTR shirts are pretty much out of the question, though, surprisingly, every once in a while some have large enough collars for my problem (without being outrageously big elsewhere).
Yeah,I know what you mean…that look is very English,with it’s almost scooped out waist,the polar opposite of the American sack suit/jacket…..
I saw a video (from Put This On I think) that said a jacket should end at the thumb when your arms are hanging relaxed at your sides.
Also, how do you tell if it’s the shoulder hitting first or that little bit of padding that sticks out into the sleeve?
Just like jose_jackson’s discussion above, this is a perfect example of there not being hard and fast “rules of style,” and that you should have your own personal style. This website is more about guidelines and recommendations that you interpret as you see fit. For me, I would never wear a blazer/suit jacket that covers my butt all the way; that would feel way too long to me, but I’m 22 and skinny, and I think a slightly shorter jacket can make some people look a little taller and trimmer.
And to say that GQ has done a “huge disservice” is probably overstating things– anybody or anything that tries to make most schlubs pay more attention to their appearance is good in my book (even though some things they promote or recommend can be silly at times).
So, to you, is this feminine or not? http://images.allmoviephoto.com/2008_Quantum_of_Solace/2008_quantum_of_solace_wallpaper_006.jpg
Y’know I thought that looked a little spacious too when I added it in. Truth is, I can’t even stick two fingers in there side by side. It’s the ratio custom. Don’t know why it looks off. Probably because I’m holding my chin way up and stretching out my neck for the pic (which, isn’t a good example.)
Updated. Same shirt, different angle, no stretched out neck (and boy, I need to shave.) And for the heck of it, I tried to shove four fingers in there. Nope
Not even three.
Great post. The only question I have remaining is how far down should a waistcoat come on my waist? should it cover the belt? Just reach it like a tie? I really like the look but I have a really long torso so I want to do my homework before I pull the trigger.
You’re gonna want to stick with shirts where the sleeve lengths are separate from the neck / body size. Unfortunately those are more expensive. Fortunately they’re usually better. Check out ctshirts.com for good deals on quality shirts.
Doesn’t show up
Really? That’s odd. Let’s try this then: http://dappered.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/QOSJacket.jpg
Love the shirt by the way!
That one isn’t because it’s a clear angle. I think Gioforeal put it nicely: sometimes the jacket looks scooped out. Not in that Daniel Craig photo but in others. I’ll see if I can find one.
I think you’re talking about when the bottom flares out and it looks more bell shaped. That gives the guy a wider hipped look, which is more feminine.
Great post. It’s rare to see a man wearing a suit that actually fits. What really gets me is seeing men who work in the suiting department of nicer department stores wearing ill-fitting suits. (My local Nordstrom comes to mind.) It reflects badly on both the salesman but the store itself.
It might have to do with posture, too. For me, if I get jackets tailored as much as would like in the waist area, the vents don’t stay closed and my butt looks huge. This is because I have excellent posture (thanks to 7 years of gymnastics when I was younger) and my lower back is very concave.
Your hips should be wider than your waist. This is natural. The problem is when your hips appear wider than your shoulders. That’s feminine.
If you don’t want your hips to flare at all, you can always go with the frumpy sack cut. Or maybe you can bring back the Ike jacket.
As a tall guy, I have to completely disagree with your take on break. With long-legged individuals such as myself, anything shorter than a medium break screams “high waters.”
I’d say this is somewhere between medium and full, and is perfect IMHO.
http://christianseiersen.files.wordpress.com/2010/06/trousers-full-break.jpg
I could see that being too much length with very slim fitting suits, but with something more traditional, I wouldn’t have it any other way.
Much better; THAT is how a collar is supposed to fit. Let no one say Joe doesn’t come through.
Looks just fine to me. More than fine. I think the line between full break, half break, and almost no break has gotten so thin that sometimes it’s hard to really distinguish between the two. That’s the problem with a lot of this stuff. Lots (and I’m certainly not saying you here) want to make all these definitions rules, black and white, etc… there’s lots of grey.
I don’t think complete coverage of the belt, but showing a little belt. Kinda like a tie, yes. That said, you can’t adjust a vest like you can adjust a tie, so finding one that’s dead on perfect is gonna be a challenge for some. So, if you find one and it looks good? And maybe it covers all the belt but still looks good? Screw it and wear the hell out of the damn thing.
Like I said, same shirt, same neck. Just should have not giraffed out like that the first go round.
You tellin’ me to ditch my man corsets? Kidding. Agreed.
Put on the jacket, and move directly sideways toward a wall. If the shoulder fabric begins to smush before you feel your arm touch the wall, it’s too much. Do it a few times to make sure.
Generally, I like the last button to be just above the belt, which lets the rest of the waistcoat fall over my belt instead of fighting with the last button.
I agree with Jose – jachets that are too contoured to the body (like some of the indochino examples) just look kinda off. the problem is not so much that it may fit tight, but that the hips flare up like a skirt (hence the feminine look). the jacket needs to drape, rather than cling to the body, which some of the recent fitted blazers and jackets do
Yep, they’ve overdone it by an inch or so
Fair enough. Truth be told, I also started with GQ, but every time i pick it up lately I simply cringe. they are taking things to extreme lately. I have some sympathy – it must be hard to find something to write about month after month considering that the basics of fit are not rocket science – but not too much sympathy (their job is to make us hate the stuff we have and covet stuff to hate next year
I could not disagree with this statement more, but that’s just my opinion.
Hey Joe, Can you point me in the direction of a great tailor, i reside in New York..
You don’t want your shirt bunching at the top of your pants and mushrooming out under a too-short waistcoat. I think tall, thin guys are generally screwed in this regard. You can’t wear a loose waistcoat, but having it too short is probably worse. I bought the previously recommended Hawkings-McGill (dappered.com/2011/11/how-to-wear-it-the-blue-chambray-shirt/) and really like how it turned out.
Me: http://t.co/i3Vxm5lV
When you say shirt seam at the “shoulder” do you mean the furthest point out on the shoulder blade? “shoulder” can mean different things
btw, check also the suit jacket length – it completely covers his azz/crotch, and even extends a little past the thumbs.
It’s also photoshopped to complete hell and more cartoon than photo. But regardless, I’ll split the difference with you here. I disagree with your opinion that you think they overdid the sides, agree that the drop looks good on him. But I don’t think it’d look bad an inch shorter.
That is quite sharp, sir. That Hawkings-McGill post is what got me started thinking about waistcoats in the first place. I’ll have to see how it fits length wise but that seems like a great place to start.
I’m with you Adam. I’m not so much for “cling” but skim. And if you’ve got an athletic frame like say, Daniel Craig, I’m all for getting jackets that dart in.
I’m not so much into the true sack suit scene, so maybe I agree, but it depends on the definition of “skim”. for me this means being able to fit about a fist or so underneath a buttoned jacket (and still have a very nice silhouette).
In any case, if there is any X-shaper pull in the fabric around the button in a buttoned suit, it is probably too tight (yet this styling has been popular last few years). If you look closely at the Daniel Craig photo you posted, you can see the jacket pulling around the button, so objectively it is a tad tight.
Not to beat this horse completely into the earth’s crust, but yes branxini, I’m absolutely convinced that in your opinion, you think that suit jacket is too tight.
I have a problem, today I just took my suit in for tailoring, and my tailor was able to take everything in to my liking except for the sleeves. I feel they are too baggy and he said he can’t take them in anymore than he already did. I am sure I am not going to be happy with the result because the rest of my suit will be slim fitting and the sleeves are going to look baggy. Is there really a limit to how much the sleeves can be slimmed? I have seen pictures of guys with tailored suits with extremely slim fitting sleeves, like this for example: http://unwrappedphotos.com/wp-content/gallery/august-2009-gq-cover/channing-tatum-august-2009-GQ-article-suit-lowres.jpg
I was hoping to achieve a similar look. Doesn’t have to be that perfect, but at least somewhere close. What should I do??
I’m 6’2″ and usually go for 32 inseam, giving between medium and no break.
No problem at all in my opinion. I think this “high waters” stuff is just insecurity.
That would look alot better if the bottom button was undone and you didn’t have a belt on. Belts create too much fuss around the key area. You want people looking at your face (or great shoes) not your crotch. I recommend Alan Flusser’s Style and The Man for a great depiction on how a waistcoat should fit and everything else you could ever want to know. A waistcoat should be slightly longer at the back so as to cover a protruding waistline when bending over.
Joe, thank you beyond all belief for posting that. Hah like you said, if you’re incredibly fit, (like Daniel Craig) you can pull off a tight suit–see the Skyfall suits, for example. Not feminine at all. Those are getting a lot of grief from people, but I think they look amazing!
50 shades of it, to be precise.
I have experienced this same thing. And i hate to tell you this, but, i had to change tailors. Narrowing the sleeves is very complex and cost more than most other alterations. A tailor who isn’t comfortable doing this will not admit that it can be done.