From the Mailbag: The Tuxedo Free Black Tie Preferred Outfit
Top Photo Credit: Chad Magiera
My wife and I are invited to a friend’s wedding next Spring. The ceremony starts at 3pm and the cocktail hour is at 5:00pm with a sit down dinner to follow. The reception is at a very nice resort here in Charlotte. The invitation says Black Tie Preferred. I will not rent a tux as they always end up being ill fitting. Buying a tux really is not in the cards as we just had our second child and my wife is taking time off from work to raise our girls. Do you think I have to wear a tux? I’ve included a list of what I plan to wear instead. Would this be appropriate?
– Steven
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Two things. First, “Black Tie Preferred” is odd. It means male guests are requested to wear a tuxedo, but a dark sharp suit with minimal flash will also be acceptable. It’s especially risky at a wedding because the groom runs the risk of not being the sharpest dressed guy there. And that can be awkward. Say the groom is in something that’s a little too big, a little on the dated side, or a rental. Then a guest shows up in a made to measure Tom Ford. Ouch. Now the second point is this: black tie is evening wear. The ceremony is starting at three? In spring? The invite might say “preferred” but the meteorological / horological conditions seem to give Steven and other guests leeway. Here’s what he’s got planned, with some quick analysis and your take is welcome in the comments…
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JCrew Factory Thompson Suit in Dark Charcoal – high $100s – high $200s
The use of the word “preferred” is kinda annoying. Some could interpret that as implying: “We want you in a tux, but if you just can’t seem to make that happen you knuckle dragging nincompoop, well then I GUESS that’s OKAY. Gosh. Really. Whateva.” Of course that’s not how the couple to be wed feels (better not be) but it puts pressure on those with financial priorities that don’t include owning evening wear. A dark, well tailored suit with white shirt and dark tie & shoes is a more than fine play. The only ding against the Thompson is the slight marling to the fabric, but honestly… it’s 3 o’clock in the afternoon and that marling is barely noticeable. Gives it some nice depth too. Full review here.
C.T. Wool Waistcoast – $50 ($230) , Ratio Pinpoint French Cuff – $89, & a Black Silk Tie
Good on Steven here. Well played. He says the waistcoat, even though it’s from Charles Tyrwhitt and not J. Crew Factory, matches exactly. Uncannily well. That’s key because it has to match. It also increases the dressed-up factor, as does the french cuffs on the shirt. Lose the waist coat and french cuffs and you’d probably still be okay, but those two things show the extra effort. The black silk tie keeps it formal.
Allen Edmond Chester Wingtips – (out of production)
Sorry fellas. Chester’s dead (whether butts were above the hard deck or not is inconsequential here). It’s a discontinued wingtip that Allen Edmonds isn’t currently making, but AEs last forever, and these are the black shoes Steven wants to wear. Yes they’re a full brogue / wingtip, but the lacing is closed (true oxford) and that keeps them from looking too casual. Would they look right with a tuxedo? Nope. They wouldn’t. You want smooth, sleek shoes then. And wingtips and brogues have a casual history. But if Steven shines them up before the wedding, they’ll merge well with the depth of the suit fabric. Black leather belt of course to match the shoes.
Garnet with white dots pocket square – $8.00 via thetiebar
Didn’t get a picture from Steven of his pocket square, but this might be in the ballpark. It’s the one sliver of color his outfit has, and it’s probably best to keep it a sliver instead of an enormous poof. Black Tie is supposed to be as sharp and without color as it gets (unless it’s a midnight navy tux.) Adds some personality while looking a hell of a lot better than some fire engine red paisley cummerbund a guy in a rental might wear.
The Bottom Line:
This is tricky. Everything from the time of the wedding, to that damn “preferred” word, to the awful state of the rental tuxedo industry. If the purpose of Black Tie is to get people looking their best, than isn’t a well tailored getup like this light years ahead of what most would consider “following the rules” and getting a rental complete with bad plastic patent shoes? Thoughts, suggestions, all of it are welcome in the comments.
that waistcoat is really interesting – but the collar? theres a thread in the forums asking this very thing
Joe do you have a picture of the back of the CT waistcoast? I read in threads that it is teal in color and wanted to see if I could find something to match it.
IMO the best alternative to a tuxedo for ‘black tie preferred’ *is* a charcoal suit. Black suit may be good, but then you’ve just got another mostly useless piece in the wardrobe.
I think all the details are fine here except:
1. I’d drop the waistcoat for two reasons. First, I wouldn’t want to add another layer, and also I don’t like the lapeled waistcoat under a suit. This is a waistcoat meant to be worn alone, IMO.
2. Keep that pocket square white but with lining to spruce it up a bit.
Nice shoes.
Most of the suits in Boardwalk Empire have lapeled waistcoats under their suit coat and they look great, IMO.
If you’re looking for a waistcoat with an unusually high or low collar, vintage repro sites work wonders. I got the vest I wear with my tux off of Gentlemen’s Emporium when I couldn’t find a low cut formal waistcoat with a full back anywhere else.
I want to thank Joe for putting this together. We exchanged a few emails last week and he was a huge help. Since he was kind enough to make this a feature I will add my thoughts on why I picked each piece.
1. Suit – This is the orignal Thompson and it fits like a glove. When i bought it and took it to my tailor she said it fit so well there was nothing more to do and she thought it was bespoke.
2. Waistcoat – I was scared of the lapels as well and even started a thread in Threads. (threads.dappered.com…check it out) but as I told Joe it is crazy how much of an exact match it is for the Thompson. JRok; BE was my inspiration for the look.
3. Shirt and tie – Nothing really to add it will make the outfit that much more formal.
4. Shoes – The Chester(Copperpot) really plays well off the texture of the suit.
5. Pocket Square – That is the excat one I am getting. The “theme” of the wedding is to celebrate the marriage of a LSU grad to a South Carolina grad. Both the bride and groom were part of Greek societies in school so they are still living out their college years. 🙂 The color is to honor the Gamecocks and there will be no poof.
1. While a lapeled waistcoat is tough to formally pull off the match makes the suit appear as retro 3-piece suit.
2. See my comments above about the reason for a colored pocket square.
The back is teal. This concerned me at first but it I take my jacket off at the reception then it will look great with the black tie.
Thanks man. We love that show.
My issue with the Thompson suit is that the pants look baggy. I guess I need to try it on to see how it fits.
I will say I went to a black tie ‘preferred’ wedding at a similar time of day and year. I made similar assumptions to Joe. I was the only one not in a tux. Next time I’d just go black tie.
I think you nailed it.
I love lapels on a WC — uber classy. And I think your approach to the time-of-day and the request is spot-on (I’m tempted to make a remark that would open a new category in the “Snobs” post).
The only thing I would change is the shoes and this in spite of the fact that I otherwise love them. Cap toe with no brogueing would be my option (assuming that you have such a shoe in your closet).
That said, the pictured t-shirt would be a bold choice.
Hurts when people have black tie pref or req that early in the day. Call me a stickler for tradition, but you should pick early with suits or later with black tie pref. I’d also go with a tux, but only because I own one, but I think the above will look great as well.
I hate when it says “preferred.” For my wedding next May, I’m just going to go ahead and say, “Look your best. If you show up in jeans or chinos, I’m not serving you dinner.”
The outfit looks good though.
No waist coat should be worn alone.
Yeah, especially compared to the cut of the jacket. I barely had the sides taken in on the jacket of my cotton Thompson suit, but had the seat and thighs taken in, hemmed to short break, and reduced to an 8″ leg opening on the pants before they looked right.
I really like this post, but I have two issues that I just can’t get over — those shoes are an abomination. A true oxford wingtip? Franken-shoe! I can’t think of anything that such a mixture would be appropriate for, they aren’t conservative business dress (CBD) appropriate, and the closed lacing also makes them look a little too formal for the kind of ultra-casual wear for which the wingtip was designed. Wouldn’t the questioner be better suited with a simple unadorned black oxford (preferably a wholecut in my mind, modern and sleek but not clunky) which WOULD be formal enough to not look out of place with a tuxedo and yet is versatile enough to go with non-black tie items like the charcoal suit sans waistcoat/double cuffs.
Second, the pocket square. C’mon, Joe! You’re killing me! The guy is already bending the rules by not showing up in the requested tuxedo, now he’s gonna wear an item that is so far beyond the realm of approved black tie wear like a pocket square? He should be trying to make his suit look MORE like a tux, not less like one. The pocket square seems to fight against the added formality of the waistcoat and silk tie.
Also worth mentioning is to perhaps suggest to the questioner to get silk laces on the shoes, makes ’em more black tie appropriate.
Steven, you’ll probably look better than 90% of the guests and give the groom a run for his money in this attire. Go for it.
Kenneth, I respect that you have an opinion on the matter but see my comment on why I am wearing the pocket square.
I do have a pair of Bostonian Cap toes, but thought these would be more fun. I need to make a test run with the outfit to see what I prefer.
Steven your outfit looks great. You’ve explained why your pocket square isn’t white otherwise I’d suggest it be, since this seems to be an overly-formal wedding. (Requesting black tie before 6pm? Bad form.) This is just a preference thing for me, but I don’t like lapels on my vest. However, if you’re going to be taking off your jacket most of the evening and hit the dance floor, I think it might be a nice touch.
“Those shoes are an abomination” – That’s an enormous overreaction Kenneth. C’mon. I think they look more than just fine.
And as far as making his suit look more like a tux, I like the fact that Steven is walking the line here between making it look like a tux, and embracing the fact that he is NOT wearing a tux. LSU/S.C. colors aside, I think it adds something. No one is going to mistake him for being in a tux. So, why not?
HA! Nice.
Why would black suit be useless? I use mine all the time.
Am I the only one who isn’t a fan of waistcoat with lapel under jacket with lapel? To me, the doubled lapels look strange and goofy. A vest without lapel works as a waistcoat. A vest with lapel strikes me as rather less formal and more appropriate worn separately.
Not sure why you’re going with the vest anyway, as I don’t think a three-piece is any more inherently formal than a standard suit.
black tie at 3pm?? Even 5pm is pushing it
I’ve never really understood the American way of wearing a dinner jacket (tuxedo) for a wedding. As the name suggests it is evening wear so I wouldn’t feel it is quite right for daytime when weddings usually are. As such, I much prefer the outfit you have put together above and is also closer in appearance to my preference which is morning dress. I would say that if you are getting the waistcoat from CT they also do a great line of shirts and you could easily sub in one of their slim fit sea island cotton shirts.
I own the black Chesters mentioned in the post (thrifted) and they are great all-purpose black shoes. I work in the legal field, in and out of courtrooms on a daily basis, and I regularly wear them with a suit or blazer and trousers. Are they the most conservative black shoe available? No. Are they perfectly acceptable in 95% of circumstances men find themselves needing black shoes? Absolutely.
You might get crap for wearing a black wingtip if you’re a financier/investment banker, or some kind of corporate lackey, but otherwise, black wingtips are well within the range of acceptable men’s business shoes. In fact, I’d say the Chesters are several steps above most of the black plastic bricks you see on men’s feet in business or formal settings.
Would I wear the Chesters to meet the Queen? No. But since I don’t plan on doing that anytime soon, I am perfectly happy to wear them in the office and the courtroom.
The thing is, Americans are dumb about these things. We just are. We don’t have an aristocratic class setting the example for us by regularly showcasing “the rules” about formal attire. Our “aristocrats” swim in piles of money and wear whatever they feel like. In the UK and other countries, you simply learn these things by absorbing them through culture. We don’t learn the traditional rules from anybody. For the past half century or so, the tuxedo has really only made an appearance in America at high school dances, weddings, and on performing musicians.
There is no distinction made as to whether the tux is “morning wear” or “evening wear” – it is simply regarded as the superlative formal attire for men, so men wear it on big occasions like weddings. Morning dress, on the other hand, is simply nonexistent in mainstream America. Most Americans wouldn’t have the slightest idea what a morning coat is or when you’re supposed to wear it. I doubt even East Coast, old money families really utilize morning dress anymore. As far as I know, the last major American figure who publicly wore morning dress was JFK during his inauguration.
Liz: “Why are you wearing a tux?”
Jack: “It’s after 6, what am I, a farmer?”
That was the comment I self-edited.
I love wingtips — at Max says, “fuzzy.” But lately I’ve been influenced by trad-English types to begin thinking of them as less formal — even in black. Since you’re going less formal (but, IMO, more “correct”), maybe they’ll look right. But with the waistcoat tipping upward, the ‘tips send a mixed signal.
Of course, that’s an abstract opinion which I reserve the right to change when I crash the reception.
I know where you’re coming from on the oxford/derby debate, given the historic origins of the brogue. But the closed-lace wingtip is a staple of traditional American shoemakers Allen Edmonds and Alden. It’s not without long precedent (at least what stands for “long” on this side of the Atlantic Ocean).
In re: a pocket square with a tuxedo, I refer you to Will of ASW who, while operating in the financial stratosphere of expensive mens clothing can, I think, be regarded as an authority:
“When overcome with the urge to add color to evening clothes, I allow
that there are four accepted ways to do so. A red carnation is fine, as
is a colored pocket square, and hose in a complementary color or with
clocks or some other decoration in a color. A colored waistcoat probably
defines the outer boundary of propriety. In my opinion, and I am joined
in this by a large crowd of others, no-one should ever wear a colored
bow, especially a white one.”
http://asuitablewardrobe.dynend.com/2007/02/dressing-for-dinner.html
Give him a run…but let him win!
“Black Tie” should NEVER be modified. It’s either black tie or it isn’t. “Black tie optional,” “Black tie preferred,” and the like are abominations, in part because everybody knows that a tasteful navy or dark grey suit is acceptable for “Black tie.” The purpose of “Black Tie” isn’t to force anybody to spend a lot of money, and it isn’t even to get people looking their best — it’s to get the men to look the same so the attention is focused on the women. That’s also the reason that long ties, funny cummberbunds, and, God help us, black shirts aren’t okay. Be an adult and leave your creativity to your cargo shirts and graphic tees. Black tie is for grown-ups. (/rant)
you mad, bro?
Nah, the only person who you shouldn’t look better than is the Bride – and that’s a stretch being a guy.
Pierre; I have photographic proof that I own neither cargo shirts (do they exsist) or graphic tees.
No worries Steven: a tasteful navy or dark grey suit is acceptable for “Black tie.” Enjoy the wedding!
I’d like to think I’m everybody, and I wholeheartedly disagree that a navy or dark grey suit is acceptable for a “black tie” event. However, they are acceptable for a “black tie optional” or “black tie preferred” event.
The link doesn’t seem to lead to your thread.
Am I the only one who’d just email the groom and say, sorry I don’t have a tuxedo, I’m planning to wear this, is it acceptable? This way we don’t have to go through the future mystery of is this ok to wear.
Dang. I was kind of hoping it was the tuxedo t-shirt.
The first paragraph of this post made ZERO sense. This author might be knowledgeable when it comes to suits, but he’s obviously very out of touch when it comes to weddings.
First of all, “Black tie preferred” on an invitation is NOT odd at all and is a very common request. It’s a little bit more direct than “Black tie optional” which means the bride and groom really want an elegant atmosphere.
There is usually no risk of the groom being outshined by a guest because whenever a wedding invite requests black tie it means the groom, groomsmen, father of the bride and father of the groom will all be in well-fitted tuxedos.
It goes without saying that the groom will be in a very well-fitting tux that was tailored. So even if it’s not a designer brand he will still look very good.
Secondly, the old rule that black tie is evening wear never to be worn in the afternoon is an OLD OLD OLD etiquette rule than NO LONGER APPLIES today.
Churches/chapels/synagogues have time restrictions which means often times you have to have the ceremony (exchange of vows) early in the afternoon.
Also, many venues where the reception will be held (the reception is the party after the exchange of vows) have time limits as well.
Also, photographers and videographers depend on natural light for the best pictures.
This is why so many elegant black-tie weddings start early in the afternoon.
First, relax sir.
Second, if I’m so out of touch, then there are plenty in the out of touch boat with me. Read the rest of the comments section and you’ll see there are plenty of people who make a great case against some of the points you’ve made. Just because you’re 100% sure you’re right, doesn’t mean the rest of the world acts that way.
I’m a big fan of the bride and groom having it be THEIR day. No one else’s. But leaving people in the lurch is sorta annoying. Make it black tie or be like the 99.9% of us out there who’d never ask their guests to even think about wearing a tux to a wedding. I mean, since when does everyone make six figures?